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tv   CNN Newsroom With Brooke Baldwin  CNN  December 9, 2014 11:00am-12:01pm PST

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all right. here we go. top of the hour. thank you so much for being with me here. what we're about to talk about for the next two hours, it is graphic, it is disturbing, brutal near drownings. medically unnecessary, quote, rectal feedings. one man chained naked on a concrete floor for days, eventually believed to have frozen to death. another detainee, sexually threatened with a broom stick.
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this is just some of what cia interrogators did inside of this pitch black and sensory deprived facility known as "the dungeon." all of this in their pursuit of information, round the clock methods of torture designed to break down terrorism suspects. all of this revealed in this report. i have it for you. at least 600 pages of the total 6,000. it took five years for them to compile the more than 6,000 pages. what i just showed you, that is just the summary. senate intelligence chairwoman dianne feinstein saying today that the cia program was far more brutal than people were ever led to believe. >> stripped naked, diapered, physically struck and put in various painful stress positions for long periods of time. they were deprived of sleep for days. in one case, up to 180 hours.
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that's 7 1/2 days over a week with no sleep. usually standing or in stress positions. at times, with their hands tied together over their heads, chained to the ceiling. in the cobalt facility, i previously mentioned, interrogators and guards used what they called rough takedowns. in which a detainee was grabbed from his cell, clothes cut off, hooeded, and dragged up and down a dirty hallway while being slapped and punched. the cia led several detainees to believe they would never be allowed to leave cia custody alive. suggesting to him he would only leave in a coffin-shaped box. >> let me begin with evan perez. and we heard the chairman fi
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feinstein -- you have been poring through all of these pages. i just want to begin with the methods, the methods used to try to get this information. can you just run through some of what that entailed? >> it is the one that the senator just described. called the hard takedown. it involved basically opening the doors to a prison cell. the dungeon as been described in this report. in which the officers, the employees with the cia would run in screaming, yelling, asking the detainee to get down, and then they would grab him, cut off his clothes, pull him outside, drag him across the floor. the detainee would have abrasions to his face, legs and hands according to this report. things like this are -- you know, it's obviously very ugly to read now. even though we've heard so much about what was going on in these sites. it's still very difficult to
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read, you know, the new details coming out in this report. and i've got to tell you, you know, i looked through many parts of this. we have an entire team looking through this. and i was struck by one particular thing. >> what's that? >> in 2003. in 2003, we have the cia send g sending, asking the white house, you know, because the white house is going out and saying we treat prisoners humanely. and you have in 2003, the cia general council scott muller, going back to the white house saying, look, you might want to stop saying we treat, you know, detainees humanely and basically making sure they're aware of what's going on in the black sites. and you see for a period that the cia also basically stops sending new orders in for interrogations because they want to make sure the white house still understands that this is what they were doing. the message comes back from the white house full speed ahead. continue doing what you're doing, you're doing good work. and so that's the big question right now, brooke, is, you know, when the dust settles on this
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report, you know, who is really to blame for these successes, these mistakes, right? was it the cia solely or the people above them? >> that's the thing, an entire conversation about how president, the white house, congress really entirely left in the dark here. and when the dust settles, should anyone be punished? should there be prison time? we're going to continue this. evan perez, our justice correspondent in washington. now, thank you. the report also says that as the cia was cruelly trying to extract this information from these detainees they were consciously keeping as evan pointed out all of this information from top government leaders. let me play more from today's hearing. again, this is senator, the chairwoman of the committee, dianne feinstein. >> in another example, the cia in coordination with white house officials and staff initially withheld information of the cia's interrogation techniques from secretary of state colin
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powell and secretary of defense donald rumsfeld. there are cia records stating that colin powell wasn't told about the program at first because there were concerns t t that, and i quote, powell would blow his stack if he were breached. source e-mail from john rizzo dated july 31, 2003. >> colin powell will blow his stack. it makes you shake your head. you include all these quotes in your piece, josh rogen, view on the headline of your piece, "bush was kept in the dark." my first question to you was, how long was he in the dark? >> what we learned today was president george w. bush didn't receive a full detailed briefing on these harsh interrogation techniques until 2006, more than four years after the program had been ongoing.
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now, bush knew some of the details and had to approve some of the techniques. but according to the cia, actually, the white house staff intentionally kept him from knowing all of these details and stopped cia directors george tenet from briefing him directly. now we know they weren't fully in the loop. >> but before we get to them defending it because, you know, president bush was on with candy crowley over the week. i want to play that. but in a second, why were they kept in the dark? was it fears of media leaks? what's the explanation? >> right. susan rice and dick cheney according to the cia documents told the cia they were afraid of press releases, but the truth is that the cia believed they didn't want the president to know. and not only the president, senate intelligence leaders weren't briefed until 2006. the full senate intelligence committee wasn't briefed until 2006. colin powell and donald rumsfeld weren't briefed until a year after the program started. there was a sophisticated plan to keep ambassadors from knowing
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when they were in the country. but also kept away from top officials. this is part of the committee's argument that the cia intentionally misled congress and the administration. of course, the cia says that wasn't their call. they were blaming the white house. >> so with, you know, definitely this outrage today, you have to hear from president bush who, again, sat down, spoke with candy crowley over the weekend defending the cia. here he was. >> we're fortunate to have men and women who work hard at the cia, serving on our behalf. these are patriots. and whatever the report says, if it diminishes their contributions to our country, it is way off base. and i knew the directors, i knew the deputy directors. you know, i knew a lot of the operators. these are good people, really good people. and we're lucky as a nation to have them. >> so he's saying these are good
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people. i read a quote from dick cheney, i believe, i'm roughly quoting, this is a bunch of hooey. both of whom supporting the cia and the men and women who they see as those trying to protect is especially in incredibly tenuous times right after 9/11. >> sure, i think george w. bush is saying now what the cia documents reveal as indicated in the report is that when bush heard about some of these techniques, he was uncomfortable about them. and he told the briefers he thought it was very discomforting that, for example, one of the detainees had been forced to sit in a stress position so long he soiled himself. there is a record of bush objecting to some of these techniques. cheney not so much. the bottom line is that the white house didn't want the president to know, so he didn't know, and now, of course, the cia says that some mistakes were made. overall, they corrected those mistakes. but in those first months and years, a lot of these mistakes, which were not previously known are now being shared with the public. and that is the significance of this report today. >> thank you.
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>> thank you. also, key voice in all of this, arizona senator john mccain addressing his colleagues from the floor there today on capitol hill. shortly after the senate intelligence committee's report was released. and while many of his republican colleagues have very, very strong disagreements with this report, senator mccain endured torture as a prisoner of war in vietnam came out strong in support of this report's release. here he was. >> i rise in support of the release, the long delayed release of the senate intelligence committee's summarized unclassified review of the so-called enhanced interrogation techniques that were employed by the previous administration. to extract information from captured terrorists. it's a thorough and thoughtful study of practices that i believe not only failed their purpose, to secure actionable intelligence to prevent further attacks on the u.s. and our allies.
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but actually damaged our security interests as well as our reputation as a force for good in the world. its use was shameful and unnecessary and contrary to assertions made by some of its defenders and as the committee's report makes clear, it produced little useful intelligence to help us track down the purpothe perpetrators of 9/11 or prevent new attacks. i know from experience, that the abuse of prisoners will produce more bad than good intelligence. >> so harsh, strong words from one republican. here's another republican. saxby chambliss with a dissenting view. disagreeing with the reveal of the report. >> finally yielded the identification of jose padea.
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so during a five-daytime period, he got less than ten hours of sleep, yet the majority does not acknowledge this was an enhanced interrogation. the claims that the fbi was exclusively usie ining rapport building tactics is nothing short of dishonest. gleaned from the enhanced interrogation that started in april of 2002, served as the foundation for the capture of additional terrorists. and the disruption of the plots those captured terrorists were planning. his information was also used to gather additional actionable intelligence from these newly captured terrorists, which in turn led to a series of successful capture operations and plot disruptions. by the study's own count, the
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numerous interrogations resulted in 766 sole source disseminated intelligence reports. now, that's an awful lot of actionable intelligence collected under the cia program that this study tries to quietly sweep under the carpet in an effort to support its false headline that the cia's use of enhanced interrogation techniques was not effective. the study also overlooked several crucial intelligent successes that prevented terror attacks against the united states and our allies around the world. al qaeda affiliated extremists subjected to the techniques made admissions that led to the identification of the man responsible for plotting the september 11 attacks, ksm. the program also stopped
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terrorist attacks on the u.s. homeland and against our military forces overseas. al qaeda affiliate statements to interrogators led to the identification of jose padea and al qaeda operative tasked with conducting a terrorist attack inside the united states. the interrogation of ksm and akned disrupted plotting. a critical base of operations in the war on terror in africa. and at that time, home to some 1,600 u.s. military personnel. there's no telling how many lives this program saved in those particular interrogations alone. intelligence gathered under -- >> his dissenting voice. this was all democrats from the senate intelligence committee who released this what we can see the 600-page executive
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summary of some 6,000 pages from the cia torture report. and a lot of republicans are furious this was released. . we're going to explore both sides here. will anyone be punished? we'll explore the legalities of this whole thing coming out today. plus, with the world so vulnerable and the u.s. engaged in war, currently against isis terrorists, how will america's adversaries react to this cia torture report? we'll discuss this, stay with me. you're watching cnn's special live coverage. i lost my sight in afghanistan, but it doesn't hold me back. i go through periods where it's hard to sleep at night, and stay awake during the day. non-24 is a circadian rhythm disorder that affects up to 70% of people who are totally blind. talk to your doctor about your symptoms and learn more by calling 844-844-2424.
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the torture report today. to sum it up in a word, reveals actions undertaken by the cia that whether justified or not are downright creepy. detainee number one, purported aid to osama bin laden. according to this report, his interrogation was so brutal, it drove the agents who saw it, quote, to the point of tears and choking up. and, remember, these are cia agents we're talking about here. they tortured this man. tortured zubaydah for 17 consecutive days, 400 hours of nonstop torture. when you look at this report, it indicates he was told the only way he would leave was in a coffin-shaped box. and the cia made plans to cremate his body should he have died in custody. that is one prisoner. one of 119, all of whom were subjected to enhanced interrogation techniques. karen greenberg here with me now. she's perhaps the tiptop authority on the cia's treatment
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of detainees. she's the director of the center of national security here in new york. thank you so much for spending some time with me. >> thank you. >> we may keep you beyond this segment here just to use your brain and your knowledge. i want to begin with the notion -- it's hard for me to wrap my head around, 400 hours of nonstop torture. when you hear that number in all these details that are coming out, does it surprise you what you're learning? >> actually, not. >> no? >> there are many of us who are reading through the report of amnesty international and a number of other organizations. and hearing from people in congress who have thought that very draconian, harmful, cruel, death provoking measures were taken. and there are a number of people in the country who have been trying to say this for a long time. and the report finally just gives more detail and a little more legitimacy to these accusations. what is surprising about the report is the degree to which
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the cia tried to cover it up. >> white house, cabinet officials. >> and that is surprising. to actually see the interoffice exchanges and to see who was intentionally kept out of the loop and to compare what happened on paper and the documents, which was told to the congress is rather, actually, shocking. even for many of us who have been cynics about what's been told us about torture. >> is rogue the right word to describe the cia? >> yes. >> going totally above or around the white house in congress? >> what's really interesting about it is it is rogue, and yet, there was an attempt to get legal cover for it from the department of justice. and they did get it to some extent. and what this report seems to say is that even with those legal parameters, they went beyond those. so, yeah, it is -- it is rogue. >> back to some of the details, and i don't know how many people at home have begun to sort of sit and read all of this and i'm sure we're putting some of this
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for you on let me begin with these black sites, right. we're learning about these black sites. scattered around the world where detainees were secretly tortu tortured. there was a site called cobalt where detainees were held in complete darkness and shackled in isolated cells. constant loud noise, loud music and only a bucket to use for human waste. detainees were dressed in diapers, they were suggested to what the report calls rectal rehydration for no medical purpose. they were dragged from their cells, clothes cut off, hooded and dragged up and down this long corridor while being slapped and punched. this was done, from what we understand. this was done by these contractors. who were the contractors? and were they thinking, okay, i'm doing this in the name of americans? >> yeah. eventually what the cia did and what this report talks about is they outsourced the tortured two contractors, and in particular, two specific contractors, this is all been documented in the
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past by journalists. and they -- and these contractors got in excess of $80 million to do this eventually. >> $80 million? >> were promised more, but the program ended before they delivered on everything they'd been contracted to do. and they were neither interrogators in the past, nor people that were used to extracting this kind of information or anything like that. and they were charged with figuring out what techniques would work and how to use them. and so we knew that the cia had contracted out many of its torture-related activities. and we knew it was to the gentlemen and their company. but we didn't see the details of it until now. so it is surprising. >> karen greenberg, can you spare me a few more minutes here? i want to keep you on the other side of the break here. you bring up, we talk about rogue, the cia going rogue. the next question, will anyone be prosecuted? we'll talk to several guests who say these are no doubt crimes that it's a pretty simple case. he'll explain, karen will rejoin me. cnn's special live coverage. stay here.
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the details about the cia report are out. now for the follow-up. will anyone be charged. with me now professor jonathan turley and back with me, karen greenberg, director of the center of national security at the law school. so, professor, let me begin with you here. i mean, when we talk about, we were just discussing with karen, the whole notion of misleading congress, misleading the white house. what is the punishment for doing that? >> well, what's fascinating
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about this report is that it runs the entire range of criminal acts. from torture, which is a crime not just under international law, but under u.s. law. but it also includes clear references to criminal acts from obstruction to destruction of evidence to lying to congress, lying to federal investigators. it really covers the entire section of in terms of criminal acts. there's never been that much of a debate from experts as to whether crimes were committed under this program. what is under debate is the commitment to do anything about it. president obama was heavily criticized at the beginning of his first term when he went to the cia and assured them that people would not be prosecuted even though we are obligated under treaty to do exactly that. this was, in fact, torture.
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the first official u.s. torture program. that's what we're talking about. it's not enhanced interrogation, it is well documented, not much really there to left to the imagination. it was torture. >> it says the legal justifications for the cia's enhanced interrogation techniques relied on the cia's claim that the techniques were necessary to save lives. and according to the report, it didn't, so it was thus unfounded, right? >> well, it's interesting you should bring that up. it's very troubling to see, even today, the cia claiming that the use of these torture methods was, quote, effective. under the international law, under the treaty that we helped write, it does not matter whether you got something out of torture. it doesn't matter if it's effective or not. it's not just a crime, it's a war crime. and that treaty protects our people, not just other people,
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people of our forces that are captured on a field of battle. that's why senator mccain's comments were so poignant, standing there is a victim of torture. it was a real profile of courage. >> you know, karen and i were talking on the commercial break about the book you have written and about colin powell. and we heard chairwoman feinstein saying one of the reasons why the white house was kept out of the loop, she was saying the then u.s. secretary of state colin powell would've blown his stack. and you were saying back in 2002, he was sniffing something out. >> sure. and he flagged this issue of interrogation. nothing more than that early in 2002 in a memo raising questions about what we were doing in terms of classifying individuals as enemy combatants. and one of the issues he did focus on was just what professor turley mentioned, reciprocity. if you're going to go out of others in this way, what will happen to you in terms of your relationships with them. on the issue of prosecution and what's going to happen. it's not just about the united
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states. the united states will decide what it's going to do going forward. but the international community has been upset about this for a decade. and it has threatened to prosecute one individual or another from the bush administration. now they have more ammunition and they can make it very difficult for these individuals to travel and to do other things for fear of being indicted, arrested, whatever abroad. so it's a larger question than just our domestic scene. >> global ramifications, ramifications here at home on so many levels, i should also add. thank you both very much. i want to continue on. u.s. military members overseas. this also potential repercussion. they're on high alert right now because of the release of this cia torture report. should one expect retaliation against our military? we'll talk to christiane amanpour live in london about that next. to truck is still missing. so my buddy here is going to help me find it.
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backing to breaking news. torture techniques by the cia. an organization shows today's report yielded little traction so far. but our correspondent at the pentagon, barbara starr says the threat of retaliatory attacks could come in days rather than hours. we're watching that. let me go straight to christiane amanpour, host of cnn's "amanpour." christiane, to you first, i'm
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mindful of the timing of the dropping of this report. do you think isis or any of america's other adversaries are following this news as closely as we are out of d.c. today? how much do you think they think this is significant? >> well, i'm certain that the news is being followed. top u.s. officials including the defense secretary say they have picked up no sort of buzzes of potential retaliation. although, we have, and everybody knows that embassies and military bases are on heightened alert. but as one of the legal experts who i interviewed said, look, the navy s.e.a.l.s who are competing to boast about shooting osama bin laden in the face have been doing that publicly around the world and there hasn't been any retaliation against that. i would say potentially more likely would be some poor civilian or anybody and tortured or had their throat slit again, you know, in that kind of individual thing that we've already seen from isis. >> i'm wondering, too, as i was
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thinking about, you know, we've seen the videos involving isis and, you know, prisoners held hostage in the orange jump suits, right? that's a nod to the guantanamo detainees. they are waterboarding. how else might isis use what they are seeing in this report as sheer propaganda? >> well, you know, you've seen their videos. their idea of propaganda is unlimited. they can twist anything and use anything they want. most people who you talk to say there's never a good time to publicize something like this. what would be the perfect time? but, on the other hand, and certainly from governments around the world, i would say it's remarkable that this has actually happened. it really does show a country that is willing to put out even the worst of its dirty laundry in public, around the world on global, social media, internet, on television, and try to make
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that a lesson learned. very, very few if any governments around the world would ever do that. and obviously, that is one of the -- one of the strengths. certainly one of the big things that i've found in my interviews just recently, the former chief prosecutor of the guantanamo bay commissions told me that, look, this is -- we knew about waterboarding, but what we didn't know was about the scale of this, you know, the deceit, the obstruction of congress, the white house and the outsourcing of all of this. the millions and millions and millions of dollars that were paid to outside contractors to do this kind of torturing. >> that's right. >> and worse, brooke, worse, that it wasn't effective. that it did not yield the so-called ticking time bomb scenario that most proponents of this kind of interrogation say is necessary. it just didn't according to the investigation. >> $80 million, apparently, to two specific contractors according to my last guest who has written a book on all of this.
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here's a different way to look at it. i want to pose this to you. is it possible one could see this as the united states coming out stronger that finally this transparency and this report and this is something that vladimir putin would never ever do. is that a possibility? >> well, precisely. that's the point. i can't think of another government that has or would do this kind of thing whether western democracies over here or dictatorships and authoritarian regimes just wouldn't be doing this. and i think, obviously, philosophically, morally, ethically, that is a strength of the united states. to confront this massive wrong doing to put it out in public and to try to move forward in a way that corrects that and makes sure that doesn't happen. you know, when you think about it, this all goes back to the days after 9/11 when secretary of defense donald rumsfeld cast out the geneva conventions and said i don't give a you know what about the conventions,
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these people are terrorists and we're going to get them any which way. and to that point, though, what's happened as your previous guest said, while this may or may not be strictly illegal in the united states and you know all the tortured legality that has tried to justify this, it is most definitely a crime under international law. and so my guest, former colonel of the air force, the former prosecutor at guantanamo bay said he would advise any americans named in this investigation or at all tainted by this to vacation domestically. that is, you know, a real worry they may, you know, be head up under international law for this kind of activity. >> it's interesting. christiane amanpour, thank you very much. appreciate it. >> thanks, brooke. outgoing defense secretary chuck hagel is overseas, talking to our chief national security correspondent there. what he has to say about the release of this massive senate report and the safety of u.s. troops all around the world.
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the senate report on the bush era interrogation tactics say the cia misled congress, the public, and the president, the commander in chief here at the time. george w. bush kept him in the dark about what was happening. in this report, outlines hundreds and hundreds of pages of detail, what many people are characterizing. in a word, torture. some were drowned or kept awake for 180 straight hours with their hands shackled above their heads. some of the most sensitive information has been redacted in this report, but still, the united states is fearing retaliation from militants all around the world, especially when it comes to the men and women who are so bravely protecting this nation overseas. cnn's chief national security correspondent recently spoke to
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outgoing defense secretary chuck hagel. and he's live with me in kuwait city. and as it pertains to this report today, jim, how is secretary hagel responding to this? >> well, i'll tell you, his chief concern, brooke, are exactly those men and women you mentioned. remember, two major deployments in this region. you have 11,000 u.s. troops in afghanistan. we were visiting them with secretary hagel this weekend. 1,000 more into 2015, then under the initial drawdown plan. and then across the border from kuwait here in iraq where we were visiting today. you have the president authorizing now up to 3,000 troops, and countless ships across the mediterranean, the persian gulf here in bahrain. all of those service members exposed to potential retaliat n retaliation. here's how secretary hagel described that threat to me this morning. >> in light of the danger, do you think it's a mistake to release that report?
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>> well, you know, the president has said that we need to be honest and get this report out. the congress feels pretty strongly about this. we have had an opportunity to redact some of the most sensitive parts of that to protect our people. >> -- prepared for the fallout even with the redactions? >> well, i've advised them to have all of their commands on alert because we want to be prepared. just in case. we've not detected anything specific anywhere. but we want to be prepared, and we are. >> now, secretary hagel said that a number of those redactions to the report helped mitigate the threat. while they have no specific
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threats they're following, they do believe in general, there may be retaliation. they're keeping their eyes focused on friday prayers, brooke, that is often a time an inflexion point, a chance to express frustration and demonstrations in past cases like this. >> what about since i have you and you have this opportunity to speak with the secretary of defense, did you ask him about the isis and any progress being made there? >> on situation room, et cetera. he said that he was encouraged by what he heard and saw in iraq that the iraqi security forces are making progress. even said they're beginning to go on offensive operations to this point. they've been primarily in defensive positions, just trying to hold back the isis advance. but still, u.s. commanders very realistic. they say it's a number of months before these iraqi forces are going to be capable. you talk about the troops across
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the border, brooke. this is a war that everybody describes in terms of years. and that means that the deployment of u.s. forces there likely to be in years too. >> we look forward to more of your interview later on today. thank you so much in kuwait city. back to our coverage of the cia's use of torture here in just a moment. the report that's out today. we're following another developing story for you. this nfl quarterback, just awful here, had a huge game this past weekend. you see him on the ground, rushed to the hospital. rachel nichols up next with what she learned. but first, a reminder to catch dinosaur 13, the discovery of bones in south dakota turns into a legal nightmare. 9:00 p.m. eastern here on cnn. get ready for some german engineered holiday excitement.
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they've had trouble before with the stop sign. we do know that cam newton's truck collided with another car. and his truck flipped three or four times. you can see his roof is completely caved in on the passenger side. but fortunately on the driver's side seems to have held up better. and you can also tell he was getting treatment from the paramedicsment witnesses say he was responsive to the paramedics when he was being strapped on to the stretcher there. the injuries did not seem to be life threatening. he was talking to people loaded into the hospital. and he's still at the hospital right now. obviously a gruesome scene. and just by coincidence, if you've been to charlotte, it's a tightly compact downtown area. that's right near the stadium, also right near every major business in charlotte, including the news organizations and the "charlotte observer." we're seeing this almost in realtime. >> so he's at the hospital now. we don't have specifics on injuries yet. >> well, what we do know is the
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panthers have released he's in fair condition. >> okay. >> he's given tests a the the hospital and will remain there for observation overnight. we had this tweet flash up if you want to show it again. this is a photo from the "charlotte observer." and it's him smiling, maybe he's grimacing, but he is obviously conscious. that's from the scene. certainly good to see him propping himself up. maybe smiling a little bit. certainly not delirious with injury. >> that's a good sign at least. >> and a good sign. >> and there's multiple reports from panther sources saying he didn't suffer serious injuries. probably no broken bones, but they're working through that. they're going to give him tests and see. now, tomorrow morning is normally when they'd be starting to prepare for their next game, sunday. they are leading the nfc south, bad division as it is. this is obviously now that we know that he is safely out of the woods as a human being and he seems fine -- we can talk about football and see whether
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this is -- >> okay, thank you so much. coming up next, back to our breaking news, back to this explosive report, details the cia's use of torture against detainees. we're getting reaction from the united nations. one representative says those who did this must be held responsible. this is cnn special live coverage.
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you are watching cnn breaking news here this hour, i'm brooke baldwin. thank you so much for being with me. we're beginning with this. this senate select committee on intelligence. this is actually the executive summary, right? so this is the 600-page, we'll call it the notes of the 6,000 pages of this massive, massive report from the u.s. senate. hear some of the most brutal accounts of torture you may ever hear. detainees stripped, diapered, strung up, beaten, rectal force feedings. one freezing to death while shackled to a concrete floor. another detainee sexually threatened with a broom stick. and then there was the waterboarding. a series of near drownings for hours and hours on end. now, this is exactly what some of the interrogators did, some of whom were contracted out in
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the attempts to break down terrorism suspects. dianne feinstein said the cia misled the president, misled the congress about what extent of what they were doing inside this pitch black, sensory deprived facility known as the dungeon. >> in another example, the cia in coordination with white house officials and staff initially withheld information of the cia's interrogation techniques from secretary of state colin powell and secretary of defense donald rumsfeld. there are cia records stating that colin powell wasn't told about the program at first because there were concerns t t that, and i quote, powell would blow his stack if he were breached. source e-mail from john rizzo dated july 31st, 2003.